Walt Lindala

00:00

This episode brought to you by cafe Imports, Minneapolis based importers of fine specialty green coffees. Independently owned and operated since 1993, Cafe Imports has been dedicated to decreasing its impact on the earth through renewable energy, carbon neutrality, and by supporting conservational efforts in places where quality coffee is grown and also where quality coffee is consumed. Where does your coffee come from?

Frida Waara

00:24

And by the national parks of Lake Superior foundation. As a nonprofit, we rely on support from listeners like you. If you like what you hear, please consider a donation. To learn more and make a gift. Visit us@www.gosuperior.org.

Walt Lindala

00:54

Welcome to the Lake Superior podcast.

Walt Lindala

00:56

I'm Walt Lindela.

Frida Waara

00:57

And I'm Frida Wara. We are made stronger by story, and there's no better source than the continent's largest body of fresh water, Lake Superior.

Walt Lindala

01:07

So join us as we highlight the five national parks that ring this greatest.

Walt Lindala

01:11

Of the Great Lakes.

Walt Lindala

01:13

Meet the people, tour the places, and learn about the projects that make these parks and body of water so remarkable.

Frida Waara

01:20

This podcast made possible with the support of the national parks of Lake Superior foundation and media brew Communications.

Walt Lindala

01:27

I'm Walt Lindela.

Frida Waara

01:28

And I'm Frida Warra.

Walt Lindala

01:30

Welcome once again to the Lake Superior podcast, Frida, today it's always fun to talk to folks that have some good interpretations and ideas about the Great Lakes, lake Superior and beyond. And you've kind of worked on setting this one up. Tell us a little bit about what's going to be happening.

Frida Waara

01:44

Well, you know, I love to be in the company of word masons, and especially when their topics are our great lakes and our water and our outdoors. Get in a canoe, get in a kayak, get out there and explore, maybe following a bird dog or whatever it might be. And there is no one better in the great state of Michigan to write about our lifestyle, our water lifestyle, and the beauty that we find around us in the Great Lakes, than Jerry Dennis, yeah.

Walt Lindala

02:12

We welcome author from Traverse City, Michigan, Jerry Dennis, to the podcast. Good day and welcome.

Jerry Dennis

02:19

Thank you, Walt, Rita, thank you for that nice introduction.

Walt Lindala

02:24

Looking forward to this conversation. We like to establish our guests a little bit to our regular listeners. And can you tell us just a little bit about your path and how you became a writer? And were you ever looking at other things? How'd you get where you are today?

Jerry Dennis

02:39

Well, I think I wanted to be a writer from very early childhood. My mother tells me she would find me scribbling on pages and pretend cursive because I didn't know how to write cursive. And she'd ask what I was doing, I said I was writing a book, and I'd have a whole stack of these scribbled on pages. I was enchanted with books. I just fell in love with them as soon as I started being able to read just the magic of those scratch marks on a page. And I think I started heading that way all along when it became apparent to me my junior year of high school that I was probably never going to make it as a shortstop for the Detroit Tigers. So I had to make an adjustment at that point.

Frida Waara

03:23

But, Jerry, to write about what you find is the material for your stories. That, to me, is just where it's the best, because truly, we talk a lot about boots on the ground living, and that's you. It might not always be boots on the ground, it might also be waders or it might be paddle dips, but that's where your stories seem to come from.

Jerry Dennis

03:45

The two great loves of my life, besides my family, of course, are books and the outdoors, and it took me a surprisingly long time to realize that I could combine the two. I went to college and studied fiction. I was studying world literature, which I loved, and I just couldn't believe what a scam that was to be able to take classes and mainly just to read books and talk about them. And I thought I was going to be a fiction writer, and I am. I've always written short fiction. But a few years out of college, I realized, you know, I can. I can fold these together. I can write about the things that I love to do, and it's the best excuse ever for getting out.

Frida Waara

04:29

Where did you go to college?

Jerry Dennis

04:31

I went to northern in Marquette.

Frida Waara

04:35

Well, there you go.

Jerry Dennis

04:38

The problem with Marquette is that there are so many distractions. I spent so much time fishing, canoeing, camping, skiing, that I was having trouble keeping up with my schoolwork. And in those days, this was in the late seventies, there were very few jobs. I believe, if I'm remembering right, there was 25% unemployment in the up, and I had a family. My wife and I got married before college and then had a baby in Marquette. Our first son was born there, and suddenly I needed to make a living as well as go to school. So we had to leave the up temporarily, and, well, we thought temporarily.

Jerry Dennis

05:19

And I went off and finished, of all places, at the University of Louisville, which is a long story, but it was a place that interested me, and as it turned out, was a great place, and I liked it there, but I didn't like that the water was brown, so I couldn't wait to get back to Michigan.

Frida Waara

05:35

Oh, yeah, there you go. And you're talking about that water again. And one of the reoccurring themes, can you ever find yourself writing when you're away from water?

Jerry Dennis

05:48

God, I don't know if I've ever even tried. I mean, obviously in Louisville, I think by missing it so badly while were there, I think I kind of shaped my future work because I started writing a lot about what I was missing. First and foremost were the rivers and lakes and the Great Lakes. I think my first inclination of writing a book about the Great Lakes occurred at Louisville. Sitting up in my little attic study in this hot house with no air conditioning, in Ohio river valley summer, I was thinking about cool, clean water and the Great Lakes. And I was thinking, boy, nobody has ever written the book I want to read about the Great Lakes.

Walt Lindala

06:39

So out of that comes your first work, and youve done 13 books, it says here, according to the information from Frieda, and one of those was a new edition of a book that you actually published about 20 years ago. Its called the living great lakes, searching for the heart or searching the heart of the inland seas. Can you tell us a little bit about this particular piece? And then lets talk about your writing after that a little bit, but tell us about this book and whats that kind of its history and the message.

Jerry Dennis

07:09

Well, you know, that's the one that was the eventual fruition of those days in Louisville, thinking about what I was missing. And that goes back to earliest childhood. My mother's family is multi generation from Leelanau county, and I spent a good chunk of my childhood in Leelanau county on the shore of Lake Michigan, exploring it. We were given lots of elbow room or lots of tether in those days and could go off anytime we wanted, basically, and explore and walk the beach and, of course, fish and do all the other things that I love to do as a kid. And I can remember thinking, there's something so magical about this place. And I love the way that Marum grass would lean over and the tip would touch the sand in the dunes.

Jerry Dennis

08:00

And over a period of days, as the wind direction shifted, it would be a compass. It would form this perfect circle inscribed in the sand. And I didn't. Later, when I became more serious about literature and read widely, I never saw anybody had written about that. And I thought, what else have they not written about? And it turns out all the things that really touched me, like the wind and the waves and the entire ecosystem and the history of the lakes. And so I had started writing books of essays and nonfiction that were being published by St. Martin's Press in New York. And one day I was talking, just having a conversation with my editor. We were talking about what could be next, and I said, what about a book about the Great Lakes? And he said, not very sexy.

Jerry Dennis

08:51

I just mentioned to him somehow in passing that you can't see across Lake Michigan, because I assumed he knew it. And he said, wait, wait. You can't see across Lake Michigan? I said, no, you can't see across any of the Great Lakes. And he said, well, I didn't know that. And if I didn't know that, lots of people don't know that. We have to do this book. And that's how I got a contract. And there it is about the Great Lakes.

Walt Lindala

09:12

So you go from there, you start writing about the Great Lakes. You start telling these stories. How much of what you wrote about or write about is based on your thoughts, and like your, like, you're mentioning.

Walt Lindala

09:24

It, you missed it, and you wanted it.

Walt Lindala

09:26

And how much comes from perhaps, actual experiences when you're writing about these things?

Jerry Dennis

09:31

Well, a lot of it comes from my experiences, a lifetime, basically, on the water. And I wanted to tell the story of the Great Lakes, but I didn't want it to be just a boring chronicle. I wanted it to be a narrative. And it took a while to get that. I spent about three years just traveling around the lakes. I circled all five lakes twice and stopping in ports and interviewing people and just looking for a way to get into the subject. Andrea. Which is why I used the subtitle searching for the heart of the inland seas. It was hard to find because it's huge. It's a huge subject. It's pretty audacious to think you can write the story of the Great Lakes in one volume.

Jerry Dennis

10:19

I was determined to do it, and the key for me, finally, was I realized I had to tell the story from the decks of boats. And I did that. Several kinds of boats. But the primary one, the through line of the whole story, is the schooner Malabar that I became a crew member on. And we sailed it from Grand Traverse Bay on Lake Michigan to Bar Harbor, Maine, went across four of the five Great Lakes and down and across the Gary Canal to the Hudson river, down to New York, around Manhattan, and then up Long island sound to the open ocean, and across to Maine. And then adventure.

Jerry Dennis

10:58

It was an adventure because we had a lot of things go wrong, you know, a really fun kind of storytelling way that became a way to tell the story of the lakes to pull all those elements together, the environmental history, the human history, the natural history, and my own experiences, I was able to weave in as well.

Frida Waara

11:19

Well, and the Malabar is not just a cruise ship either, is it, Jerry?

Jerry Dennis

11:25

No, it's a two masted schooner that was built in the 1970s in Connecticut and was used for day trips, primarily taking people out for sunset cruises and for weddings and things. And that's what it was used for in Traverse City for many years, but it fell into disrepair and needed a lot of work, and so the owner sold it to a gentleman in our harbor, Maine, who did those kind of trips, and I helped a little bit. There was a crew that was working on the vessel to repair her. She was concrete hull and, which was new to me. I'd never seen that as ferro cement. A framework of steel rods with concrete, a special concrete mix molded onto her, and that concrete was deteriorating.

Jerry Dennis

12:18

So the crew was repairing that, and I got to watch them, help them a little bit on it for a month or so before we set sail. So, you know, she was a working boat for sure, but not, you know, cargo or anything.

Frida Waara

12:32

It's certainly one thing to set off, first of all, just to sail the Great Lakes, but to do it in a boat that's got some hull repair that's necessary. But that's very gutsy. Very, very gutsy.

Walt Lindala

12:46

So, okay. Yeah, no, I was going to. I was going to follow up on what she said, that, you know, you're out there and you've got that challenge then of keeping the ship, in effect, ship shape and being able to do this traversing that you're doing, but then you're also out there taking it all in. And that really kind of showed itself in your writing then, didn't it?

Jerry Dennis

13:06

Well, it did. It was. It was a revelation to me to realize how fast paced my life had become. And I've kind of prided myself on my adult life and not being very fast paced because, after all, I'm a writer who gets to spend a lot of time outdoors where I am very at ease and comfortable. And gradually I realized I had become addicted to social media and, you know, my phone and to this sort of adrenaline drenched pace that you can get caught up in that makes you feel good temporarily, but is really exhausting and who knows what kind of damage it does to you in the long run. Suddenly, we're on this boat for 30 days without contact with the outside world. We had no social media. We had an emergency phone, but I never used that. I would wait.

Jerry Dennis

14:01

When we'd get to ports, I would call home. But day after day for hours on end, we're just cruising along, and there wasn't a lot to do except sit and take it all in and in my case, write notes. I ended up writing a good share of the book in Longhand on the deck of that boat. And I remember thinking, why haven't I been doing this all my life? This is the pace I want my life to be lived.

Walt Lindala

14:27

But of course, we're talking with Jerry Dennis here today, who is an author from Traverse City, Michigan, about Great Lakes, Lake Superior and the other Great Lakes. And Freda mentioned something in her notes here about something with the word flow and it being an acronym for the love of Water. This got some special attention or some special meaning to you, but it also sounds like water is central for basically what you write about. Can you talk about Flow a little bit and then how that all works.

Walt Lindala

14:56

As a theme for you?

Jerry Dennis

14:59

Well, Flow is a very important nonfiction or nonprofit organization for Love of water that was started by my friend Jim Olson, who's an environmental attorney of renown. He's famous nationally for his work in protecting and defending water. And he wanted this organization to tackle some of the issues that are so prominent in the great lakes about water use and the potential sale of water. And, you know, the line five issue, which is so controversial in the Straits of Mackinac. And so right from the beginning, I've been a supporter of that group and has helped them in various ways and always try to, you know, mention them because they are doing such important work. So I urge people to look them up@forloveofwater.org. Dot. But for me, yeah, the water flows through it. I was to steal a line from a great book.

Jerry Dennis

16:01

A river runs through it. I grew up on a series of inland lakes as a child, and within a half hour drive of Lake Michigan, everything centered around water. Summer, spring, winter and fall was always on the water. It was doing something from water skiing to ice fishing. And so it became natural. And I wanted to write about the things that I care about. That was my goal right from the beginning. I could have been a hired gun to write about whatever the assignment was, and I'm sure it would have been fine if that would have been a fulfilling life. But I wanted to write about the things I cared deeply about and the natural world, and especially water kept coming up over and over in book after book.

Frida Waara

16:49

What stories in particular have come from your time on Lake Superior?

Jerry Dennis

16:55

Oh, man, there's been so many. When I was in college in Marquette, there was a weekend when I couldn't sit home anymore, and I took off. My car wasn't reliable enough to drive any distance, so I hitchhiked across the northern portion of the up to Sini. I wanted to fish the rivers, get some adventure on my own, just hike and fish and wade and camp as I went. Well, the mosquitoes were unbelievable. It was unbearable. I've been around a lot of mosquitoes in my life. I've never seen anything like that. So I jumped back on the highway and hitchhiked back toward Marquette and got dropped off, asked to be dropped off at our train.

Jerry Dennis

17:40

Then I walked along, hiked along the beach east of there, past the face in the rock, which many of your listeners are familiar with, I'm sure, and found a great spot to set up my tent and spent the weekend just basically sitting in the wind with the waves breaking on the rocks around me, thinking. And that was a turning point in my life, I realized, yes, this is. I'm a student of literature, but this is the kind of literature I want to make. I want to somehow capture what this feels like, everything about it, the sounds, the smells. So that was a turning point that showed up. That incident has shown up in a couple of my books, but I've also had these great adventures with friends and family, hiking the beaches all the way around lake spirit.

Jerry Dennis

18:29

My wife and I, when were first married, took a van and set off across the continent for six months, and we started our trip heading to Lake Superior and driving the north shore on the. On Highway 17, the TransCanada highway, and just, you know, leapfrogged along the way from beach rocky outcropping to rocky outcropping, set up her tent and eat wild blueberries and watching Lake Superior. And that was that trip. And I is where I told my wife for the first time that I wanted to be a writer.

Frida Waara

19:05

You talk so much about all the lakes, but how do you describe Lake Superior?

Jerry Dennis

19:11

Well, it's my favorite. It's still wild, it's still clean. I don't hesitate to drink from the out, you know, offshore, out in the open lake, I would dip a cup of water out of it and drink it without any hesitation. You can't. I wouldn't do that in any of the other lakes. The weather and the water and the landscape are so entwined. I love looking at the wind warped pines along the shore, seeing that shape that they take in this constant wind off the water, and how dynamic that is. And how emblematic it is of the region, the smell of the lake, and, of course, well, really everything about it. So that's where I go whenever I need to be replenished. I head north, and we're 150 miles from it, which is too bad.

Walt Lindala

20:08

Well, it's funny you mentioned that, because, like myself, I grew up in the copper country. I grew up outside of Houghton, on Portage Lake, on a little town called Chassel. If you hear from up here, you have an idea of where it is.

Jerry Dennis

20:19

Yeah, yeah.

Walt Lindala

20:20

And so. But I've been living in Marquette since the mid eighties, and my wife and I, who was originally from the Detroit area, we will go on a trip. We might go visit some friends or family or something in Detroit or go to Chicago or wherever. You know, we normally go from up here. And the first thing that we do when we get back into Marquette is, at the very least, go for a drive along the lake around Presque Isle and Marquette, and then just kind of get that energy of the lake. And it's really interesting listening to you as an author, putting this into words, because sometimes it's really hard to do that, because you just.

Walt Lindala

20:53

Either you're so used to it or you're so overwhelmed by it or whatever, and you're doing that with these, in particular about lake Superior, but all of the Great Lakes.

Walt Lindala

21:02

How do you do that?

Walt Lindala

21:03

And. And when you're, like, sitting at your desk and you're working as a disciplined writer, how do you work on doing that? I mean, how can you. What is your sort of. Your process?

Jerry Dennis

21:14

Well, it's challenging in the sense that when you live in a place for a long time, it gets harder to see it. You sort of get immune to it, or you get calloused or something. And the way I fight that is, first of all, not repeating myself. I don't cover the same subject specifically many times, like some writers do. I mean, they become known for a certain subject, fly fishing for trout, say, and they can make a very satisfying career out of just doing that. But I'm trying to do something different. I'm trying to really get at what a place is, what it really is like. It's true nature and its true character, the thing that makes it unique in the world.

Jerry Dennis

21:59

The only way to do that is to come at it from all angles, in all seasons, in every mood, and work hard to see it as it is, to see it clearly, not see it the way I expect it to be or that I remember it being. But my goal is always to try to see the world through the eyes of a child. If you. We all remember that when you're a child, everything is wondrous, and then we get kind of immune to it. But the fact is, everything is wondrous. And if we can reconnect with those perceptions of childhood, then it becomes clear to you how wonderful it is.

Frida Waara

22:39

You have been at that desk for coming on four decades. Jerry, has your message changed? There's been so much in this world we didn't 40 years ago. We didn't even really entertain climate change. I know it was out there, and some folks were probably trying to warn us. But so many aspects of what your message is. How is that evolving, and how are you evolving with it? I guess.

Jerry Dennis

23:10

Well, that's a good question. I got some really good advice from the editor of an environmental magazine many years ago when I was pretty much starting out. I had been at it full time for just a couple of years, and that was at the very beginning of awareness about climate change. It was 1989, I believe. The first couple books had just come out, and people were just starting to think about this. But at that point, it was all still computer models. There wasn't a lot of hard data, but I could see that it was going to become increasingly important. And, of course, I was also concerned about water and air pollution.

Jerry Dennis

23:56

And I asked this editor who I'd done a few stories for, I asked him if he thought I should tackle some journalism on these subjects and see what I could come up with. And he said that he thinks my role is different than that. He had a lot of really good, Pulitzer Prize winning journalist who could write powerfully about issues and make them clear to readers and stuff. But this guy urged me to try to reach readers hearts. And it sounds a little sappy, maybe, but I knew immediately what he meant, because that was the kind of writing that I loved to read myself from childhood on, reading stories, essays, stories, poems that connected with something deep inside and made my eyes a little wider and a little more open and made me want to protect places.

Jerry Dennis

24:50

So that was my goal right from the beginning. I'll try to convince people through their hearts instead of their minds, because it's what I'm probably better at. Or maybe I'm just not very effective at convincing people to think other than they do, but I can make them think, feel something. And I've seen it over and over all my life, that when people feel a connection with the place, then they want to protect it.

Walt Lindala

25:17

We're talking with Jerry Dennis here today on the podcast. He's an author out of Traverse City, Michigan, about the Great Lakes, about lake Superior. And I guess the question is, what are you working on now, and how can people find out more about some of your other works and what you've written?

Jerry Dennis

25:33

Well, I spent the winter finishing a collection of poems, which is a matter of great hilarity to my wife because she made me promise when were first married that I would never be a poet because we had just been in San Francisco and the hippies selling their mimeograph sheets for $0.25 each to make a living. So she figured that's what I would end up as if she let me. So finally, she's given me permission to write poetry, which has always been a love of mine. And I'm putting the finishing touches on a new and selected book of essays I took. I picked 40 of my favorite essays out of ten books and plus a dozen or so new ones and are compiling those into a volume.

Walt Lindala

26:20

How do people find out about your books? Do you have a website for yourself.

Walt Lindala

26:23

As an author, or do you work.

Walt Lindala

26:24

Through a particular house? I mean, how can they get some of your books if they're interested?

Jerry Dennis

26:29

Yeah, well, of course they're always available at every bookstore or online. But my website, I keep a calendar of events, speaking engagements, and recent stories that have been published and a description of all the books. That's at jerrydenness.net dot.

Walt Lindala

26:47

Is there someplace, do you have a favorite time of year to write about? Is there maybe somewhere. I mean, Freda and I have been watching and talking kind of here as you've been talking or looking at each other. I can see we're wondering a little bit of the same thing. Is like, what's kind of your favorite? Especially if we're talking about telling the lake Superior story. Is there a favorite season, a favorite place, or something like that really gets you going with your writing?

Jerry Dennis

27:11

Sure. You know, for most of my life, I always thought autumn was my favorite season. But hey, I'm 69 years old now, and, you know, it's not as romantic to see the world declining as it used to be. I found myself more and more enamored with spring and all the things that you can do in the spring, from mushroom hunting to fishing to birding. I'm a passionate birder. I love to watch the migrant warblers arriving and keep track of them. And my favorite place is on Lake spear, but I can't tell you where it is. It's an amazing place. You have to take about 15 miles of gravel road to get to it. Dirt and gravel, and it's a gorgeous stretch of beach that there's rarely anybody on. And my wife and I go hike the beach.

Jerry Dennis

28:02

We camp, we search for agates and watch birds every May. We do that.

Walt Lindala

28:07

Well, we certainly understand why you don't necessarily want to share that. But, you know, it's been a pleasure having a chat with you here today about this. Hopefully, you get some folks to check out your books again. That website for you is what?

Jerry Dennis

28:20

Jerry Dennis.net Jerry, it's been a pleasure.

Walt Lindala

28:24

Having you on the podcast here today. Best of luck with everything. Enjoy the Great Lakes, enjoy lake superior, and we hope to talk with you again soon.

Jerry Dennis

28:31

Thank you guys.

Walt Lindala

28:33

That's Jerry Dennis, who is an author out of Traverse City, Michigan, talking about his books and writings on the Great Lakes and especially Lake Superior and Frida. You know, it's interesting because he made up, he made a comment about how the more you are somewhere, the less you see it. And there is a definite truth to that for myself, having lived along Lake Superior in Marquette for 35, 37 years now, you know, I don't disrespect it and I don't sell it short, but it does become sort of the. You know what I mean? It's like you get used to it. Like, I know I've told the story before, but with the blues fest that I helped produce in Marquette, there was a writer and his wife from Detroit that came up for it, and they operate a magazine out of the, out of Detroit.

Walt Lindala

29:17

And they said, why don't you ever talk about that? And it was like we thought were talking about the old ordoc in downtown Marquette by the park. He said, no, the big lake is. You're on Lake Superior. This is a great spot for a festival and a great place to be. And it's like, well, yeah, obviously, but none of us thought of it because it's always there. But Jerry really, in my opinion, tapped into that energy, that creativity. The thing I talk about how there's just a power in lake Superior, and I think it's really in his writings.

Frida Waara

29:45

And, you know, what I felt was, we need to have somebody with us. So what we need to do is be a little bit of a guide, because as soon as, like he mentioned through the eyes of a child, and it might not be a child, but somebody knew, the idea that someone knew. So, you know, just, we realize how much people need what we have right around us. You know, the other thing I got from them, walt, I can't go for a walk anymore without having a paper and pencil in my pack.

Walt Lindala

30:15

I know you're gonna have ideas that.

Frida Waara

30:16

Are gonna hit you. Yeah, you know, and write that down. Write that down. We all saw that, how we described that simple thing like how the dune grass will bend over and etch a little compass, a circle, and animal tracks. You know, I mean, from the geese to the turtles to, you know, somebody else's dog running down the beach. It's really fascinating. And just pay attention.

Walt Lindala

30:39

Well, it's really interesting how this whole conversation really kind of moved around how he went from the various great lakes to obvious power of Lake Superior, which is why we like to talk about Lake Superior and the national parks around it. If there's something that you want us to talk about, maybe you've got someone you know as a writer, an author, an experience or something. You can get us a message through the national parks of Lake Superior foundation website. Wherever you're downloading this particular podcast from, you can send us some thoughts on it. They'll get to us because we're always looking for folks to talk about and stories to tell about the big lake. And this was really good. That was Jerry Dennis, author from Traverse City, Michigan, and we certainly appreciate his time today. That's going to do it for this time around.

Walt Lindala

31:20

On the Lake Superior podcast.

Walt Lindala

31:22

I'm Walt Lindelo.

Frida Waara

31:23

I'm Frida Warrah. Thanks for listening. The National Parks of Lake Superior foundation is the only official nonprofit 501 fundraising partner of the National Park Service for all five us national park sites on Lake Superior.

Walt Lindala

31:41

To learn more about NPLSF projects and programs, you can visit the website@nplsf.org or friend them on Facebook.

Frida Waara

31:49

I'm Freda Warrah.

Walt Lindala

31:50

And I'm Walt Lindela. Thanks for listening to the Lake Superior podcast.

Frida Waara

31:54

This podcast made possible with the support of the national parks of Lake Superior foundation and Media brew Communications.

Walt Lindala

32:02

This episode brought to you by cafe imports, Minneapolis based importers of fine specialty green coffees. Independently owned and operated since 1993, Cafe Imports has been dedicated to decreasing its impact on the earth through renewable energy, carbon neutrality, and by supporting conservational efforts in places where quality coffee is grown and also where quality coffee is consumed. Where does your coffee come from?

Frida Waara

32:26

And by the National Parks of Lake Superior foundation. As a nonprofit, we rely on support from listeners like you. If you like what you hear, please consider a donation. To learn more and make a gift. Visit us@www.gosuperior.org.